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Old 18-08-05, 21:38   #1
87calais
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R33 Gearbox - clutch question.

Hey,
Can anyone here confirm for me wether or not the 10" VLT flywheel and clutch will fit inside the bellhousing of the R33 5 speed.

Not looking for speculation here, want replys from people who have done the job themselves and know for certain.

Thanks guys.
Scott.
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Old 18-08-05, 21:48   #2
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sure will man did on mine
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Old 18-08-05, 22:25   #3
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grind the inside lip just a bit to be sure.
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Old 18-08-05, 22:33   #4
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Done it in my brothers car and it fitted fine and a mate also did it but had to use a bit of grinding paste as the flywheel was rubbing very slightly. They've both also used MX7 throwout bearing carriers. My mates clutch wouldn't work properly with the R33 one as they are slightly different in size.
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Old 19-08-05, 11:52   #5
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questions

i just bought a vlt with a r33 box and no engine in it used to be rb25 so i wanna drop my rb30et into it. the car came with a ceramic button clutch to suit the old set up but i also have a ceramic button clutch from my mx7 what clutch do you guys reccomend using and how does the speedo work as i was told that on the r33 they are electric, and also what tailshaft fit into it?
thanks
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Old 19-08-05, 12:50   #6
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this has been covered 1 million times, search for it
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Old 19-08-05, 14:10   #7
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tail shaft- use the mx7 one as it fits onto the R33 box.

speedo sender- use the mx7 one, bolts straight in.

clutch- my suggestion is use the one that came with the car as it's a 9.5" and has alot more clutches to suit. the mx7 is the 10" one and my guess is there wouldn't be many hi performance clutches to suit. and then u know if u use the 9.5" flywheel/clutch it's going to fit into the bellhousing without any scrubbing.

(off topic)i helped a mate with the manual converion on my car before i bought it off him. so thats all i know first hand. i got a R33 gearbox on the way atm. so i'll know for sure in a few weeks if u can use the MX7 fly and clutch. MX7's in my opinion are ****. on my basically stock VLT the MX7 blew within a few weeks of putting it in the car. i have to double clutch everywhere if i wanna change gears or it just crunches.
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Old 22-08-05, 07:57   #8
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Thanks for your help guys.
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Old 24-08-05, 03:16   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turboluke
this has been covered 1 million times, search for it
i bet he has, and hasnt got the answers that he was after.... maybe as he said he just wants people who have done it, not just someone tellin him to search for opinions!
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Old 24-08-05, 09:33   #10
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i have done it myself in my garage and that is my opinon,
was not trying to be rude
i used to spend a lot of time here writing up detailed explanations, just like many other people. To keep having to do it is wasting time. Couple this with the fact that people will swear their lives over different facts just makes for more arguments.
the answers are there i guarantee it.
you just have to sift through the crap.
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Old 24-08-05, 13:11   #11
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thats the problem, bucketloads of crap!.

Just wanted to hear from guys like yourself, who have done it, the facts. Not interested in "i was on the phone to a guy who's dog went to the house of the sister of a guy who said that he had heard they fit", not even interested in "my mechanic said it fitted when he did my box". Not having a shot at you, im normally the first person to tell someone to do a search if i know things have been covered. I just needed facts from people who had done it.

Im in the same boat as you, will be doing it at home and im buggered if i was going to spend the money getting a 10" rebuilt only to find that it didnt fit.

Thanks again for your help guys
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Old 24-08-05, 17:31   #12
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i know what you mean, people will swear black and blue about against things i know i have done myself. PM me if you need any help other than the 10" clutch. i used a 9.5" one.
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Old 25-08-05, 10:08   #13
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yeah ive gone with the 9.5 too, saves any hassles.
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Old 26-08-05, 12:29   #14
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Ok, heres question 2.
A lot of guys seem to be using the Skyline slave cylinder, however its a smaller diameter than the VL slave. Both cars share the same size master cylinder, however the skyline uses a vac booster (similar to a brake booster) on the clutch master. This means 2 things.
1. The clutch is going to engage/disengage quicker than with the VL salve.
2. The clutch is going to be heavier than it would with the VL slave.

Now the heavy part doesnt worry me, but as the clutch im using is a ceramic item, and is pretty quick to engage/disengage as it is, will the different hydraulic ratio make it a real bitch to drive. My MX7 has a ceramic in it now and it doesnt bother me, just curious to how much difference it will make with the smaller slave cyl. Mounting up the VL slave wouldnt be hard, just need to make a bracket to hold it, but was just going to use the skyline slave to save mucking around with it.
Guys that used the MX7 bearing carrier in the R33 box, which slave did you use? Maybe if you use the R33 slave you should use the R33 carrier ?. Dont really see how that would make a difference though. The carrier length would only be related to the diaphram height difference between the R33 and VLT if any.

Thanks
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Old 26-08-05, 13:06   #15
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if you use the R33 carrier, use the R33/VL n/a throwout bearing on it. this means you have to use the 9.5 inch clutch (which you did). i think the bearings (and hence carriers) are sized to match the drive plate on the clutch where the bearing presses against the spines. the 10 inch one is bigger, and that's why.

as for your clutch throw problem, that would be a guess-and-check thing. each clutch is different and you'll never know till you try it. i know grant has a 3400 pressure plate on his full face organic clutch (VL turbo clutch) and had to use a nissan Gazelle slave cylinder so that the thing would disengage. if you have a ceramic or button clutch, i don't think it would be as much of a problem as the pressure plate is likely to be less heavy, and the engagement ramping is much more sudden and less progressively "soft".
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Old 26-08-05, 13:15   #16
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yeah thats sorta what i was getting at, the buttons are sudden anyway, with this slave it might make it a real bitch to drive. Ill just put it in with the R33 slave and see what happens.

Both the NA and VLT, plus all the skylines use an identical throwout bearing, just the R33 carrier is slightly longer than the VLT one.
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Old 26-08-05, 13:48   #17
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hmm.... i've seen different bearings for the turbo and non-turbo boxes. i assume the carriers were different as well but they may be common. the skyline one is likely different because of a slightly differently placed pivot fork or slave cylinder.

geez now i'm wondering what i should use for my R33 box, i'm hoping to get my current driven plate modded to about 3400 as grant's was, and keep the organic face clutch on there. i was also hoping to use the n/a bearing carrier and pivot fork assembly as well as the n/a slave cylinder, which is supposed to be the same for the VLT as well :s
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Old 26-08-05, 14:09   #18
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yeah the VL slaves are the same. bugger it, ill be assembling it with the MX7 carrier, the R33 slave, and if the pedal feels all crappy ill just have to dial in some revs and drop it every time i take off lol.
If its no good ill make a bracket and mount the VL slave and see how it goes.

Going to get pics and do a tech article for the site when i do it, then its all there and clearly described for everyone looking into this.
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Old 07-09-05, 00:05   #19
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I've got that prob with my brass twin plate clutch, it's a real bitch to drive on the street cos it's too bitey, was bad enough with a 7/8" mx7 slave but the 3/4" r33 slave makes it worse. I've been looking for a 1/1/8" to 1/1/4" slave to mod to fit but that doesn't seen to be too common...
Don't notice on the track though!
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Old 07-09-05, 18:36   #20
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hey guys, iv got a quick question

iv got vlt 5spd. i want to put a r33 box in it. can i take the two to my mechanic and get him to just swap it over (as in, he can use the vlt flywheel, clutch, and all the rest of the technical stuff u guys were talking about that comes in my mx7)?
or do i need to by some r33 parts?

sorry for kinda hijacking your thread, but i cant find any other useful info on this topic.
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Old 07-09-05, 18:46   #21
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ok, my box is in, i used the MX7 tailshaft, used an NA VL starter motor, NA VL flywheel with a nice clutch built for it, the clutch was a skyline clutch so i used the skyline throwout bearing carrier and i used the R33 slave cylinder. Used the MX7 speedo drive. All works fine and feels great. Only mod was i had to slot the starter motor holes in the MX7 sandwich plate to suit the box.
Took about 200 photos, will do up a tech article when i get time
Cheers
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Old 07-09-05, 19:08   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 87calais
ok, my box is in, i used the MX7 tailshaft, used an NA VL starter motor, NA VL flywheel with a nice clutch built for it, the clutch was a skyline clutch so i used the skyline throwout bearing carrier and i used the R33 slave cylinder. Used the MX7 speedo drive. All works fine and feels great. Only mod was i had to slot the starter motor holes in the MX7 sandwich plate to suit the box.
Took about 200 photos, will do up a tech article when i get time
Cheers
Scott.
did you use the n/a flywheel and starter because the mx7 ones didnt fit? or you chose to?

i did a 5spd n/a flywheel/clutch to 5spd turbo flywheel/clutch conversion (in an mf5) on my last car and i didnt have to change the starter, had to grind the bellhousing a litlle bit for the flywheel to fit in. so does this mean the starters are the same?
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Old 07-09-05, 22:38   #23
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fantastic work 87calais - you've just done exactly what i was planning on doing down the track. only difference is i'm getting a VL clutch built so i will use the VL throwout bearing and the VL slave cylinder.

back to the clutch feel question: i'm going a big, heavy full face organic clutch. is it possible to

a) bore and re-sleeve the master cylinder with a bigger piston?
b) same but with the slave cylinder? <--- though this may impact on the amount of throw it would have if you didn't do (a) first.....
c) modify or fit a larger master or slave or both from a newer model car? like a HSV commodore or something i imagine would have a rather beefy master cylinder and slave.....
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Old 08-09-05, 07:01   #24
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hey as soon as tech article is done can you please pm me as i will be doing this conversion soon. cheers and good work.
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Old 08-09-05, 21:47   #25
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i used the r33 slave and it isnt too bad, my left knee hurt a bit for a few days but now is all good. i have a button clutch and although it doesnt like slipping you can take off quite easily, quite hard to stall the rb actually, well mine is.
modifying a vl master wouldnt be impossible, the way its mounts to firewall will be awkward but a machined up spacer should do it. the vl slave has mounting holes on opposing sides of slave and the r33 one has them on the same side. i didnt like the idea of a bracket to keep the VL one steady.
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